| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Beowulf1976 |
Posted - 10/05/2011 : 22:36:03
George hasn't eaten for 3-4 maybe more months now. He was weighed whilst still eating and he was 1,100g when we weighed him yesterday he was 1,073g so he's lost 27 grams since he's starved. His rats measure average 46g (frozen weight).
He stopped eating when we demolished the snake rack and he was temporarily in his 50l rub on the side unit until I bought his vivarium., Only thing that would have changed is lighting, he was shaded on all sides except about 10cm of the front end of the rub whilst on the snake rack..
Since then he has been moved into a 3x2x2ft vivarium.
We tried adjusting the lighting, cooling the viv down before offering food, "braining" the food (crushing the skull), we have even tried annoying him with it but George is WAY too placid for that to work. He tolerated being tapped by the brained rat and he just constantly, calmly backed away from it.
We even tried putting him back in a smaller rub and adjusted the lighting as if he was on the snake rack and everything has failed.
I don't know whether 27g is a lot to lose for a Royal or whether I should be panicking by now, well obviously I'm distraught with worry because he is my baby and he's not eating.
Any advice would be very gratefully received.
Thanks in advance
Carol x |
| 20 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| hodgie |
Posted - 16/10/2011 : 09:22:00
Totally agree with Lotobob,
you ssem to be complicating this a bit, you`ve said you copied your friends setup exactly but with out the heat mat, well that isn`t exactly.
Get your friend to come around and setup everything for you then leave alone, as above for a month or 2. Nothing is going to go wrong with a 1kg male if he doesn`t eat for a while.
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| boomslang |
Posted - 16/10/2011 : 01:24:47
Have you tried leaving it in with him all night? or feeding him outside his rub/viv.Put him in a rub and place him in a dark cupboard,leave him 15/30 mins and see. |
| Lotabob |
Posted - 16/10/2011 : 01:21:24
quote:
Originally posted by Beowulf1976
all but the one end were not in darkness - like they were on the snake rack.
I finally panicked and got my snake savvy friend to get involved. She set him up, on the hot end of one of her vivs, in a 21L RUB with a towel over all but 3 sides. Few hours later she offered him a weaner and he struck, and ate.
Two weeks after we set him up, in a faunarium, all but one side covered, in his viv ("cold" end) (I quoted cold as there is only a tiny difference between his hot and cold end) and STILL he was NOT remotely interested.
My friend suggested it was technique, but Simon argues why did he eat, nearly every week on the rack.
Just cutting through a lot of info and picking out the bits I think are the important bits. I put the most important bits to me in bold.
*The first bit is you seem to have a snake that appreciates a darker setup and feeling closed in.
*If 21 Litres works, use 21 Litres.
*Having practically no difference in hot and cold end means the vivarium is not setup/performing correctly, it may need more ventillation to cool the cool end down a bit, or a smaller wattage bulb to only get a hotspot of 32oC without raising ambient too high, lack of thermal gradient can stop snakes eating.
*Simon has touched on a good point, he ate in a rack type setup, you can mock something up with a RUB and cardboard box, anything to give the fussy git what he wants (snake not Simon  ).
Its a setup issue nothing to do with who is looking after him or feeding him. Tawfik also has is spot on, get the setup right and leave him to settle, changing setup all the time is just making it worse not better. A month off food while a snake settles is nothing to worry about so you have to allow more time to settle. If I was you I would do one more switch of setup to the 21 litre setup,inside a cardboard box to mimic a rack setup, give it 2 months, no fuss, messing etc and see what happens, if that doesn't work I will eat my hat. |
| n/a |
Posted - 15/10/2011 : 23:18:47
Here you are - it's a frozen ratty demonstrating as it's no-one's feeding day. Saada's viv door open, ratty on dish, 30 secs blast on nose with hot hairdryer, turn once.
Last time she refused ...see, they're all awkward little gits!!
It's a conundrum, but honestly I wouldn't give up ...the good thing is that he's eating sporadically, so he's getting something under his belt. It IS weird, the way he'll only eat for your friend, but, he's a royal. Honestly I wouldn't give up; they are feast or famine snakes. In the dead of winter, when all our lot are fasting, your lad'll probably be scarfing the rats down like nobody's business.
All the very very best! |
| Beowulf1976 |
Posted - 15/10/2011 : 22:56:16
quote:
Originally posted by boomslang
quote:
but he coiled right up and was shaking from side to side,
what like just his head?or his whole body shaking?
It was his head and the part of the body that was coiled and raised off the floor.
quote:
Tawfik47 I think it's a big mistake to keep moving your snake, he/she needs time to settle in, u just make sure the temp/humidity/hids/water is okay, and just leave him to settle.
Once he settle he will eat for u, just keep offering food.
If this were the case he would have eaten by now!
When Simon collapsed the rack, he put George, his Boa and my Arizona on a cabinet, in their exact same RUBs, with the heat cable clipped to a board from the collapsed snake rack, so his home was identical, heating was identical... The ONLY difference in this set up, was the fact that all but the one end were not in darkness - like they were on the snake rack.
George was in this set up FOR MORE THAN A MONTH (I had to save up for vivs and equipment) and refused to eat each time he was offered.
Then George was moved to his viv, 3ft x 2ft x 2ft. Ceramic bulb for his heat, kicking
out between 30 - 32°C. He had a hide, various fake plants for other coverage and a bamboo root (4 stems) for exercise. (to climb on)
Months went by, and still no interest in eating AT ALL.
I finally panicked and got my snake savvy friend to get involved.
She took him home, weighed him and he was below 1KG.
She set him up, on the hot end of one of her vivs, in a 21L RUB with a towel over all but 3 sides. Few hours later she offered him a weaner and he struck, and ate, she said that it didn't leave a lump, so she upped the size (equivalent to a size 7 motorbike glove) and he took it again and ate.
Two weeks after we set him up, in a faunarium, all but one side covered, in his viv ("cold" end) (I quoted cold as there is only a tiny difference between his hot and cold end) and STILL he was NOT remotely interested.
We then tried faunarium, covered all but one side, on Simon's PC desk. Still no interest.
My friend suggested it was technique, but Simon argues why did he eat, nearly every week on the rack?
An important point to note, before Simon built the snake rack, George was in a 3ft x 18" x 18" viv, on his desk when he first got him, apart from shedding time, he ate every other week.
We have tried MORE plants in viv for more cover, we altered temp DOWN AND UP, we have also improved humidity. (two bad sheds in a row told us to test it, and it wasn't high enough) we have tried different coloured rats, different size rats, brained rats, different heat rats....
Right, my next attempt (tomorrow) was going to be faunarium, covered all but one side, ON TOP of the hot end of his viv. IF he doesn't feed, then my LAST RESORT is to get my friend to feed him here. IF he STILL doesn't eat (proving he's not happy here) then Simon says all I have left is to rehome him with my friend. (I love my baby to bits and would be absolutely devastated if this had to happen)
Obviously I do not want the latter to happen, but surely if he is just NOT HAPPY here, I have no choice? *sob*
Simon has suggested we put him back in a 50L RUB, which is what he was in on the snake rack. My argument against that, is that he uses ALL of his viv space when he comes out at night.
When I tried feeding him last, he didn't back away from the rat, but he wasn't interested either, after a while he turned away, BUT he came back, however, again he was not interested in the rat. Simon had a go at me saying the rat would be cold by now anyway.
quote:
BurnedAtTheStake ..yesterday I was very glad to see her nose come out of the hide when the ratty smell wafted in as I blowdried her meal next to her open viv window
Could you detail EXACTLY how you do that with hairdryer, so I can try it? Pls?
As you can see, we have tested every alteration to living conditions that we can do.
I am REALLY at a loss as to what is next!
*sob*
Nb weighed him tonight and he weighs 1,040g (my friend feeding him two rats (different sizes) obviously put weight on him again for me)
EDIT: no point trying him tomorrow, he's in shed. (got him out to weigh him tonight)
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| Tawfik47 |
Posted - 04/10/2011 : 10:30:42
I think it's a big mistake to keep moving your snake, he/she needs time to settle in, u just make sure the temp/humidity/hids/water is okay, and just leave him to settle.
Once he settle he will eat for u, just keep offering food. |
| Sam84 |
Posted - 04/10/2011 : 08:54:14
quote:
Lotabob Posted - 04/10/2011 : 00:39:01
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Move him back to the rack.
He can't Bob, they demolished it 
My Cora isn't eating either been on/off since she upgraded to viv from RUB.
Now she blue and it's been the longest shed she's ever had. in her RUB she was blue then boom! shed and shiny.
wondering whether to leave her and wait until she just accepts her new home or move back to RUB?
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| boomslang |
Posted - 04/10/2011 : 04:40:36
quote:
but he coiled right up and was shaking from side to side,
what like just his head?or his whole body shaking? |
| Lotabob |
Posted - 04/10/2011 : 00:39:01
Move him back to the rack. |
| Beowulf1976 |
Posted - 04/10/2011 : 00:06:37
We have tried to feed George since my friend had him, we imitated everything she did and STILL he won't eat.
She weighed him and he's now dropped below 1kg, so I am really beginning to worry.
On Sat night I was going to get him out, but he coiled right up and was shaking from side to side, I had literally just opened the door and put his light on. I thought he was going to strike, so left him. We hoped that he might have thought I was food, however, when we tried to feed him Sunday night, he wasn't remotely interested.
Friend now thinks it is down to technique as we imitated her set up, minus heat mat, but before we moved George from the snake rack, he ate nearly every week, so I can't see technique being the problem.
Any ideas guys?
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| hodgie |
Posted - 21/09/2011 : 08:51:06
I keep mine in rubs all year long and have never suffered temp problems, however if in doubt kept in a warmer room with a good thick towel covering the top and 3 sides will do the job more than satisfactory. |
| n/a |
Posted - 20/09/2011 : 22:15:40
Faun or rub, at this time of the year, I think it would definitely be a good idea to keep it in a viv, as it would be easier to maintain the right temp. |
| boomslang |
Posted - 20/09/2011 : 21:54:05
isn't a faunarium ( if its the flat kind) the same size as a 21l rub more or less. |
| Lotabob |
Posted - 20/09/2011 : 21:11:59
You've had a Royal demand for a smaller tub. lol. Don't forget his blankie. |
| hodgie |
Posted - 20/09/2011 : 20:37:06
quote:
Originally posted by Beowulf1976
Hi again,
George still not eating for us. My friend took him to hers, put him on a heat mat in a 21 litre RUB, covered all but one end in a blanket, gave him a water bowl... And fed him, and he struck, and ate. It hardly made a lump, so she gave him a bigger rat and he took it.
Any ideas guys? I'm not willing to rehome my baby (something Simon suggested might have to happen)
All input gratefully received.
I think you`ve answered your own question Your housing isn`t to his liking, put him back in a 21 ltr rub covered on the top and 3 sides. Good luck. |
| boomslang |
Posted - 20/09/2011 : 18:36:21
quote:
Originally posted by Beowulf1976
Hi again,
George still not eating for us. My friend took him to hers, put him on a heat mat in a 21 litre RUB, covered all but one end in a blanket, gave him a water bowl... And fed him, and he struck, and ate. It hardly made a lump, so she gave him a bigger rat and he took it.
Today, at lunchtime, we set him up in a faunarium, (only small enclosure we've got with a lid) covered all sides and put him in the cool end of the viv. and left him to settle. Tonight comes and Simon heats up a rat for him (the new size that she suggested) when he gets round to feeding him, George not remotely interested, no flicky tongue, no nothing.
Simon then brained it and that didn't work either! Simon is getting fed up because George is mine and he is having all the hassle. :(
Any ideas guys? I'm not willing to rehome my baby (something Simon suggested might have to happen)
All input gratefully received.
he's moved around alot,this new housing has hides,temp is all good etc?Where do you keep him?ie anything else kept in the same room?
whats the time frame from your friend fed him,and you trying again?Do you handle him at all?
Have you tried moving him to a rub,and just leaving him in there for 30 mins with the rat.
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| n/a |
Posted - 20/09/2011 : 11:34:19
Hey, that's really good that he's eaten - I'm not surprised that you've been worried sick if this has gone on all summer.
My Saada was like this, coming out of her fast. She was on and off for a while, and then settled down to eating regularly. Then I moved her into another viv and she refused two feeds ...yesterday I was very glad to see her nose come out of the hide when the ratty smell wafted in as I blowdried her meal next to her open viv window...
That's a really good idea, the faun in the viv, but it's yet another change for him, BUT he has got something under his belt now; he's not going to fade away overnight; he may go on being a bit slow but to me it sounds as if he'll get there. All the very best with him - keep us posted. |
| Tawfik47 |
Posted - 20/09/2011 : 09:32:55
When i got Blitz he didn't eat with me all 5 months, his weight was 600 grm and he lost 100 grm in that period, but he started to eat since two weeks, so 73 grm for a 1100 grm is nothing to worry about as BATS said. |
| Beowulf1976 |
Posted - 19/09/2011 : 23:57:15
Hi again,
George still not eating for us. My friend took him to hers, put him on a heat mat in a 21 litre RUB, covered all but one end in a blanket, gave him a water bowl... And fed him, and he struck, and ate. It hardly made a lump, so she gave him a bigger rat and he took it.
Today, at lunchtime, we set him up in a faunarium, (only small enclosure we've got with a lid) covered all sides and put him in the cool end of the viv. and left him to settle. Tonight comes and Simon heats up a rat for him (the new size that she suggested) when he gets round to feeding him, George not remotely interested, no flicky tongue, no nothing.
Simon then brained it and that didn't work either! Simon is getting fed up because George is mine and he is having all the hassle. :(
Any ideas guys? I'm not willing to rehome my baby (something Simon suggested might have to happen)
All input gratefully received. |
| n/a |
Posted - 10/05/2011 : 23:21:41
Hi, while moving housing may have something to do with stopping eating, George has been doing what every adult royal does between autumn/spring, and letting his fancy stray to the opposite sex. In other words, he's got more important things on his mind than a hot rat - he's randy! Royals don't eat during the mating season; it's normal, rather like fasting during hibernation.
My two adult girls have only eaten a couple of times this year before one of them began to eat a couple of weeks ago - the other, like George, is still fasting. My 2010 lad did a fast as well ... nerve wracking while it lasts, but they DO start eating again.
27g is absolutely nothing for a snake of George's weight to lose during the annual fast. Keep trying him every fortnight with food - he'll surprise you soon. I know it's frustrating - good luck to us all.
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