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frambo
Yearling
United Kingdom
228 Posts |
 Posted - 03/07/2011 : 18:13:30
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Hi all,
New member here. I'm based in London and hopefully in the next month I'll get my first royal.
Quick bit of background, I'm 16 and after keeping my first snake. My dad has kept more than he can remember but that was in India (many years ago) and does not know the ins and outs of keeping them in the UK where things seem to be pretty different.
After going to a reptile shop and seeing both royals and kingsnakes and corn snakes I've decided on a royal. At the moment the place where I'd be likely to keeping its viv would be our conservatory. However I'm worried that it may get too hot in the Summer and too cold in the Winter. While I realise that I can simply heat it up in the Winter, cooling it in the Summer would represent more of a problem. Any thoughts on possible methods of cooling a viv?
As well as this I have considered keeping the viv in my bedroom for the time being as this would mean that temperature fluctuation is less drastic and in the event of a fuse blowing or something if the tank cools down it should not get dangerously low in my bedroom whereas during the night it gets really cold in the conservatory.
My last question is with regard to the actual setup. Being an owner of lizards and terrapins amongst other creatures I have several fish tanks of varying sizes.
My plan was to take a glass tank with no lid and make a lid out of wood with air vents, spaces for the light to slot in and some sort of method of securing it to the tank. Then I'd line the tank with suitable substrate and within that have a smaller tupperware box (again lined with substrate) to be its home within a home. The main tank would be a bit big for such a small royal (getting a young one) but my understanding from the guy at reptile store was that having a smaller box inside it with its own shelter and water within that would solve that problem.
Does that sound about right? Or is it better to make a structure entirely out of wood and then just give it a glass front?
Many thanks, I look foward to replies and my own snake!
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0.1.0 Royal Python
1.0.0 Rhodesian Ridgeback
0.1.4Terrapin
0.0.3 Koi Carp |
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n/a
deleted
7384 Posts |
Posted - 03/07/2011 : 18:29:54
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Hi, Frambo, and welcome to the forum. If you go on to the 'general' section and look in the back pages, you'll find a thread by Stevethornley called 'Royal Python for my 8 year old's birthday', right at the bottom of page 12, or it will soon be at the top of p 13.
This is a really good informative thread which goes into setting up a royal python 'palace' from scratch. Just a couple of points, you'll have to keep your snake in the house, and no worries about controlling high temperatures, as a thermostat will do that for you, but Steve's thread really says it all. There's also a care sheet attached to this forum which you'll find useful.
Hope you get your royal soon. |
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Edited by - n/a on 03/07/2011 18:31:11 |
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frambo
Yearling
United Kingdom
228 Posts |
Posted - 03/07/2011 : 19:48:48
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Thanks!
Had a look through there and yes it is really informative! I would be getting a very young snake, about 6 weeks old so would it be better to give it a simple, basic, small and easy to clean and manage RUB to start with and then moving it into something more like what's in Stevethornley's thread once it's about 4 months old? Or is it more adviseable to get 'the perfect enclosure' set up from the outset and then keep changing that as the snake grows?
I'm a fan of keeping my pets in as natural an enclosure as possible but I'm open to the idea of a RUB to start with.
Am I right in thinking that for a RUB what I'd need would be:
RUB with lid and holes drilled
Thermostat
Light (will research which type later)
Water bowl (plant tray?)
substrate (kitchen towel)
hides (upside down egg box with entrance and upside down yoghurt pot)
Hydrometer to check humidity?
EDIT: Just seen the thread, 'kitting out a viv' which seems to have all the info I need.
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0.1.0 Royal Python
1.0.0 Rhodesian Ridgeback
0.1.4Terrapin
0.0.3 Koi Carp |
Edited by - frambo on 03/07/2011 20:02:09 |
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n/a
deleted
7384 Posts |
Posted - 03/07/2011 : 20:26:56
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Hi, yes, that's another good thread. And another free disposable hide that young royals love is the cardboard inner from a kitchen roll.
A light's not possible in a rub though, I'm afraid, but in fact you won't need one - saves a bit of money to put towards the rest of the kit. |
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Edited by - n/a on 03/07/2011 20:28:12 |
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Laws
Fully Grown Royal
United Kingdom
1007 Posts |
Posted - 03/07/2011 : 20:38:52
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| i wouls say a rub would be perfect and get a heat mat and a mat stat and then u can up the size of the rub as he goes , then when he is big enough u can think about a viv with bulbs etc , and then u would have a spare rub set up ;) |
www.facebook.com/Thehogbox
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frambo
Yearling
United Kingdom
228 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2011 : 11:52:03
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Briliant thanks that's all really helpful. for a 6 week old snake I'm guessing that the RUB that s/he came in would be fine(about 13" diagonally)? Or do I want to be buying something slightly bigger?
As for no lighting, my bedroom has its own natural light and is artificially lit till around midnight most days. Would I need to cover the RUB with a breathable curtain after natural daylight hours are over or is it fine just as long as s/he gets about 5 hours of darkness a day?
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0.1.0 Royal Python
1.0.0 Rhodesian Ridgeback
0.1.4Terrapin
0.0.3 Koi Carp |
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n/a
deleted
7384 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2011 : 12:10:53
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| Hi, the idea of the curtain is a good one, as royals like privacy and dimness anyway. When I first got Shahi I actually covered most of his rub with a towel in the daytime, just to give him a bit more 'cover' and help him settle in. When he moved to his viv, for a long time he had, on one side, his own net curtain, so that he could feel extra private. |
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frambo
Yearling
United Kingdom
228 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2011 : 12:15:00
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That was my thinking- if they're a nocturnal burrowing snake they probably would appreciate dim surroundings. However would there be any problem with suddenly turning on a light in the middle of the night to get a look at him or her? Or is that going to annoy the snake? Failing that I guess if I really wanted to look at the snake moving around during the night I could tint a bulb red and then shine that on the snake if I wanted to get a decent look at it.
Sorry for all the questions but I like to think I have a degree of knowledge on any prospective pet so that I don't end up doing something wrong and only finding out later. |
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0.1.0 Royal Python
1.0.0 Rhodesian Ridgeback
0.1.4Terrapin
0.0.3 Koi Carp |
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n/a
deleted
7384 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2011 : 13:14:33
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Hi, don't worry about the questions - they're fine.
I don't think any of us can avoid having to turn on the light in the middle of the night sometimes in a room where a snake is kept; I don't think that would cause any discomfort to the snake. Chances are, a royal would probably be asleep in its hide despite being nocturnal - royals spend so much time asleep, it's a wonder they don't get bedsores lol.
The only red light invisible to a snake is infra-red, such as that from a proper infra-red or reptile infra-red bulb. You can buy tinted red bulbs (for electric fires etc) very cheaply, but unfortunately the red light they emit is visible to the snake.
I can't think that a bit of night-time viewing, say in a room lit by one lamp, rather than bright overhead light, is going to stress the snake out - you will get to know your royal and its habits as time goes on. Some people say that their royal is out and about at a certain time of the evening; some come out to watch tv or just chill out in their owners' laps or up their sleeve or wherever. Others, like me, never know when to expect the royal presence, but a moderate period in artificial light in the evening ought not to stress out a royal that's well-settled in the right conditions. |
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heaton177
Yearling
204 Posts |
Posted - 04/07/2011 : 18:00:05
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hello and welcome.
what the other guys said :) but when i got mine i have got mine in a 4ft viv now. packet out to the hilt with brancjes and fake plants, but when i 1st got my snake i sectioned the viv off to 2ft (my snake was a good eater)
But i would start off with a rub and i always heard echo sayin if the snake is the length and width of the enclosure you can possible u[pgrade to a bigger home (3x2 FT viv being the ideal size of a full grown adult) i wouldnt rush getting it into a bigger enclosure too soon cause it will stress your snake out and cause it to stop eating.
hope i have helped and not confuzed you. |
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frambo
Yearling
United Kingdom
228 Posts |
Posted - 06/07/2011 : 10:15:26
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Thanks, those replies help a lot.
So a rub in my bedroom with no light but a heatpad seems the way to go. For the time being at least |
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0.1.0 Royal Python
1.0.0 Rhodesian Ridgeback
0.1.4Terrapin
0.0.3 Koi Carp |
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Lotabob
Royal Python Moderator
United Kingdom
5008 Posts |
Posted - 06/07/2011 : 15:58:40
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Sounds perfect, a rub, heat mat, stat, thermometers, and all the other triimings, hides, bowls plants etc is perfect. If its only a titch baby then a 9 Litre RUB is a good place to start.
Next job is picking a good Royal, try get one with a feeding and shedding record, they are known fussy feeders so getting one you know is eating well at the moment is a good place to start (though the move might cause it to not eat for a few weeks), another thing to find out is how they are feeding it, does it strike feed or does it eat out of the normal enclosure, does it eat overnight, as much information as you can get about how its feeding is going to make life a lot easier when you get it home. Oh and as for fussy feeders, its more an umbrella term, they are known to fast which is totally normal and doesn't effect the snake (and saves the owners a fortune in food) but can be stressful for the owner if you allow it to worry you, some will only eat in peace, again totally fine, just a shame you dont get to watch them eat a lot.
Get the shop to allow you to hold them, the normal response for a royal is to roll into a ball (ball python) but once they realise your not eating them they will unravel, they shall poke their nose out and tongue flick to assess the situation.
See that the snake is alert, tongue flicking and you should feel the body shuffle to grip your hand and arm.
Check the scales for damage, it should feel silky smooth, dont forget the underside too.
Check the eyes, if the snake has mites they are quite likley to be most visible there, their eyes remind be of marbles, quite boggly but very shiny.
And finally, Have a listen if you can, while holding it see that its not wheezing and it should have its mouth closed (dont hold it too close to your face, your breath can trigger a strike, I've been there before, lol).
Then the most important thing, buy it, bring it home, let it settle and post some pictures. |
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Edited by - Lotabob on 06/07/2011 15:59:14 |
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frambo
Yearling
United Kingdom
228 Posts |
Posted - 06/07/2011 : 19:05:04
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Thanks that's most informative.
I'm looking at getting a CB11 which will be about 6 weeks old from Crystal Palace Reptiles. I will look out for all those things you said. From what I understand the second paragraph is regarding things to bear in mind when choosing and the first para is once you've chosen, things to make settling in easier. I can't wait, I'm so psyched now!
Hopefully it will come with the small 9" RUB though if it doesn't I'll have to get one- will phone in advance and find out. The only things I'll have to buy will be the electrical meters and heaters... the rest I can DIY I'm sure.
I will definitely post pics of him or her when I get it! |
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0.1.0 Royal Python
1.0.0 Rhodesian Ridgeback
0.1.4Terrapin
0.0.3 Koi Carp |
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stevethornley
Hatchling
United Kingdom
69 Posts |
Posted - 08/07/2011 : 21:29:41
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Hey Frambo
Just wanted to say you're asking all the right questions and seem to be approaching your Royal addition in absolutely the right way. The community here are fantastic and you really couldn't get better advice from this chalk-face of experienced keepers.
We're now 4 months down the line and Kate the snake is well and truly at home. The only 2 times she's missed a feed were 1. when we just got her and she was still settling in and 2. when she was in shed. We're 3 sheds in and she's put on an enormous amount of weight! So much so, in fact, that we upgraded to a 3-foot viv last week. She could no longer fit in either of her hides and there wasn't enough room to fit anything bigger in.
I was anxious about going 'so big' (from her 18-inch starter viv) so we crammed it full of stuff in the hope that it wouldn't unsettle her. Good news: last week, she fed as normal. What a relief. She spends a lot of time in her hot hide but I've just seen her waltzing over to her snake cave in the cold end.
Kate is regularly handled and much loved by my son (her true owner) his 5-year old little sister and I. My wife isn't so keen and keeps her distance but has a great respect/fascination and is chief rat warmer-upper LOL.
Good luck with your adventure and keep us in touch with how you get on. Excited for you.
Best Wishes
Steve
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0.1.0 Royal Python - Kate
0.1.0 Beagle - Poppy
0.0.11 tiny tropical fish - not named |
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frambo
Yearling
United Kingdom
228 Posts |
Posted - 11/07/2011 : 12:03:04
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Hi Steve,
Thanks for the support. I'm going to head down to CPR tomorrow and choose a snake beaing in mind the advice given in this thread. I may bring it back tomorrow or may go to collect it in a week or two.
I'm pretty sure I want a female (as I understand it the only difference is size) and hopefully will have a few to choose from when I go.
Thanks |
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0.1.0 Royal Python
1.0.0 Rhodesian Ridgeback
0.1.4Terrapin
0.0.3 Koi Carp |
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stevethornley
Hatchling
United Kingdom
69 Posts |
Posted - 11/07/2011 : 21:57:24
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| Good luck Frambo! |
0.1.0 Royal Python - Kate
0.1.0 Beagle - Poppy
0.0.11 tiny tropical fish - not named |
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frambo
Yearling
United Kingdom
228 Posts |
Posted - 21/08/2011 : 01:36:59
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OK little upadate. Chosen my royal today. Put a deposit and picking her up when I've got a reliable setup ready which I won't have to fiddle with. (name undecided as yet  )
Not sure that I'm doing this entirely right, so I'm going to just say what I've done so far and hopefully you lot will be able to point out any errors.
First off I got a faunarium. Reason being that sooner or later I'm going to have a faunarium in a viv. In the meantime before I get the viv, the faunarium is on a bookshelf, wood on all sides (except front) and if I'm finding that I can't get it to heat then I'll grab a piece of glass for the front.
I've got a mat and a dimming stat (will eventually be using a ceramic in a viv so made sense to get a dimming stat) with the mat directly under the faunarium (in contact with the wood on one side and the faunarium base on the other. There is a small (2-6mm) air gap between the mat and the base but not between the mat and the wood below the mat.
Also got a digital thermometer with 2 probes. One probe is inside the empty faunarium (will put hides/kitchen paper [to start with] in due course) on top of the area where the heatmat is. Now reading 29.5 but has been climbing for the past half an hour slightly. The other is at the other end of the faunarium, not above the mat and is reading 24.7.
As for the stat probe, I've put that inside the viv for now but after doing some reading it seems like the best thing is to have that touching the heatmat on the outside and set it to a temperature that will correspond to 32 degrees inside, on top of the heatmat as read on the thermometer (read on here that the stat setting should be ignored as it works better right next to the mat anyway).
Does this all sound ok?
If after a bit the digital thermometer probe on top of the mat inside is not reading 32 then it obviously means that heating is going to be difficult (now reading 29.7 to give you some idea) then there are some things I could try (please tell me if I'm wasting my time here or these work):
1. Get some polystyrene and put it underneath the entire setup and have the poly under the mat to make heating better so the faunarium base is being heated more than the wood underneath the mat.
2. Get a sheet of glass and put across the front of the wooden bookshelf area.
Anyway, have I done everything right so far? I've read so much everywhere I'm going into information overload, not sure if what I'm doing is right or wrong or discouraged or what. Will post a pic in a sec.
Cheers |
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0.1.0 Royal Python
1.0.0 Rhodesian Ridgeback
0.1.4Terrapin
0.0.3 Koi Carp |
Edited by - frambo on 21/08/2011 01:42:16 |
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frambo
Yearling
United Kingdom
228 Posts |
Posted - 21/08/2011 : 02:10:26
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Here's a photo showing where the mat is, where the whole setup is and where the thermometer probe is. It's now on 30.9 so should get to 32 easily enough, especially once I've put the wood on the left hand side in.
Incidentally, what to do with those cables? I was thinking of clipping a small hole in the mesh on top? Humidity is giving me between 55 and 57% today so looks like I'll be fine, even with the snake and water in there.
EDIT: It's now 4AM and the temp has been pretty constant at between 31.8 and 32.2.
I'm guessing that this means that once I've put all her furniture in I should just readjust using the stat to make sure I'm getting that sort of reading on the thermometer? Would still appreciate some advice regarding placement of probes- bearing in mind it's simply a kitchen paper substrate where do I want the thermostat probe to be? And as for the hides (two to be made I reckon out of old tomato boxes/egg boxes) I was thinking one right at the hot end and one right at the cool end?
So psyched, can probably go bring her home later today! |
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0.1.0 Royal Python
1.0.0 Rhodesian Ridgeback
0.1.4Terrapin
0.0.3 Koi Carp |
Edited by - frambo on 21/08/2011 04:04:50 |
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Lotabob
Royal Python Moderator
United Kingdom
5008 Posts |
Posted - 21/08/2011 : 15:18:52
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| I dont see any thermostat wires so cant comment on probe positioning but I put my probes as close to the heat source as the snake is ever likely to get. SO on the bottom of the faun in the centre of the heat mat area, the hot side probe in the same place, a thin layer of substrate in that end and a slightly thicker layer in the cooler side works well. One hide each side and a good bit of foliage for hiding and something to climb would be beneficial. |
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A palace for my royal
