| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| speedy231278 |
Posted - 13/12/2010 : 13:06:07
Apologies in advance for asking the usual uneducated questions. I've had a look around this forum and others for general info, but I'd like make sure that I've got at least half a clue (and preferably all of it!) before I take the plunge.
Yesterday the missus and I were in a local pet shop, as she's decided she wants an axolotyl, but that's another story. While we were there, she mentioned her wariness of the size pythons get to in comparison to our corns, whereupon the owner almost immediately produced a gorgeous female royal python to prove otherwise. Unfortunately she took to both of us almost immediately, and after being able to handle a couple of equally fine examples, I've been offered an unexpected xmas present that I am struggling to refuse.
However, I don't like getting unfamiliar pets without doing a bit of research first. This particular python is apparently five years old, seemed to me to be around or approaching three feet, and has previously produced a clutch of eggs (although I'm not interested in breeding). I was told that for this size a two foot viv would be adequate as they appreciate smaller spaces and aren't particularly interested in exploring. My creamsicle corn recently moved home into a bigger viv, so I have a 24x15x15 viv going spare, which I mentioned, and was told that that would be fine. Being used to corns and the length plus depth rule of thumb I cannot help thinking that this may be a little too small for her at this size, however in the shop there are several cohabiting in an area that can't be much bigger, if at all. I'm resigned to the fact that I'm convinced on giving her a new home, but ideally would she be better off with a bit more space? I understand that like corns big spaces can intimidate them, but I don't want to cramp her either!
What size viv would you guys put a roughly three foot specimen into?
Secondly, and proably even more importantly is heating. I don't have any heat source yet because the heat mat was resued in the bigger viv. Some people would apparently be aghast to learn that we have un-statted heat mats in our current corn setups, however over several years these have worked perfectly well, giving a good temperature gradient with no thermal blocking issues. However, most people seem to recommend not using one with larger bodied snakes for this very reason, so it looks like I'll be getting some form of heat lamp. But which type, and what sort of wattage? A stat is obviously a must as even the smallest wattages I can find are many times that of the mats we have, and they keep our four foot vivs at the right temp levels, however, what sort come with the best recommmendation? I don't want a toasted snake, or a frozen one, nor a huge electric bill - I'm already running the best part of a kilowatt of kit if you add up my fish tank equipment and the existing corns! And yes, I'll be putting a guard on the lamp... ;-)
So, if you've sensibly scrolled down all the waffle, the summary is:
If you experienced royal python owners were going to be acquiring a three foot specimen to be put into a display tank rather than a plastic box, what kit would you recommend? Money isn't exactly tight, but while I don't buy cheap rubbish for my pets (or my vehicles!), I don't usually go for stuff that's flash, over the top and unnecessarily expensive. I just want something that is reasonably priced, does the job, and comes with a recommendation from people who know far better than me....
Ta! |
| 20 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Royalbob |
Posted - 22/12/2010 : 01:51:03
Sounds great speedy. Sorry mate not being rude but won't be about to answer any more questions. Wishing you good luck with the feeding mate and glad the vivs all set.
Just start a new thread if you have any probs and someone will be along to help ya.
rich |
| speedy231278 |
Posted - 21/12/2010 : 20:39:15
Well, according to the digitherms, substrate level at the hotspot is 88-89, ambient substrate is 78, near the top is 85. Rat is in the fridge for tomorrow. That could be interesting! :-) |
| Royalbob |
Posted - 21/12/2010 : 19:41:05
mmm she sounds comfy and hungry. I love it when mine move up in rat size. lol |
| speedy231278 |
Posted - 21/12/2010 : 16:21:59
Not really sure what temp the room is, but it isn't particularly warm. There's no draft by the window as such, but it isn't especially warm. I didn't get around to moving the viv last night, however as best I can tell the stat hasn't actually been pulsing in a while. I've measured the substrate hotspot several times and it's matched the setting on the stat, and the ambient has been 80 low down, 84 higher up. Digitherms arrived today, so I can stop messing about with the strip. she was insistant on coming out to play last night, twice in fact, however she's going to get fed tomorrow as that's when she was next due at the shop, so the seller said. Have a couple of medium rats as that's the size they were feeding her. Not really looking forward to that, feel guilty enough with large mice.... lol |
| Royalbob |
Posted - 20/12/2010 : 23:34:37
lol. yeh i think your all set. Would only move the viv if there's a draft by the window. Now you just need to leave snakey alone for a few days and try a feed. I would go with whatever he was eating at the pet shop to start with. What temps the room? there's no way the bulb should be running constant as the viv will hold the heat for a while. |
| speedy231278 |
Posted - 20/12/2010 : 15:09:14
OK, so the ambient is fine then... :-) Those flickering digitherms still haven't turned up yet so I'm still relying on my spare liquid crystal strip to do the susbstrate level temps. Has been 90c right by the probe the last few times I've measured, whcih is exactly what the stat is set to. Will still probably do the move because the stat isn't pulsing, it's full on, unless it's pulsing so fast that neither the light on it nor the energy consumption gadget I have occasionally attached to it can keep up. Draw is 104-110W according to that, which at our rates works out at £125 a year!!
Agree on the decor. It's a right pain in the wotsit trying to find the aftermath of the last mouse in my corn's viv as the missus keeps putting more stuff in there to keep Missus 'happy'. I'm sure she was really happy that it took me several days to find the last deposit, which had been left right on the flippin' heat mat! At least her corn always leaves his in the same place behind his water dish... Unless you put the dish too far back in the viv, in which case I don't need to draw any pictures, but you can imagine how awful the consequences are!! |
| Royalbob |
Posted - 20/12/2010 : 12:01:30
80-85F is fine for the ambient mate. It's all well trying to replicate an african Savannah in a viv until you have to clean it out. Keep my viv and rub's quite sterile, white kitchen towel, 2 hides and a water bowl. less to clean, snakes are easy to check up on and you can spot anything foreign straight away. |
| speedy231278 |
Posted - 20/12/2010 : 11:39:37
Seems a little better this morning, although the ambient end is still a little warm for my liking near the top. She's spent most of the time at the cool end, although last night she did have an explore about the viv and decided to move to the warm end. It wasn't apparent which hide she was under this morning, and I didn't want to disturb her. I've decided that I'm going to move the viv this evening so it's not near the window, and it also means it'll make it easier to take some pics. Not that it's very interesting with a piece of bark at either end and a dog bowl at the cool end! |
| Royalbob |
Posted - 19/12/2010 : 19:40:20
pics do make it so much easier as well mate if you can. |
| Royalbob |
Posted - 19/12/2010 : 19:38:19
Don't take your readings of the stat, just use it to control the ceramic bulb. Take the readings from the thermometer.
what's the temp reading on the thermometer under the bulb at substrate level? This is what you want at 90F
Your Ambient temps are fine.
Wouldn't really put the viv by a window unless there is no draft.
Is your royal thermo regulating itself? if yes then i wouldn't worry too much. It's when there constantly trying to warm up or cool down that there is a problem. |
| speedy231278 |
Posted - 19/12/2010 : 19:02:19
I've just had a quick measure again. I'm still not getting anywhere close to 90 at the substrate near the front of the viv, although the stat seems to think about 88/89 in the middle, and near the top measures around 92. The ambient end has increased a little, and is now 82 low down and 84 higher up. I was considering blocking off the vent at the top of the cool end, but figured that might actually raise the temp rather than reduce it, unless it would maybe cause more of a draw on the lower vent. I guess you'll never get a perfect 90-80, but right now I'm convinced the warm is too cool, and the cool is too warm! The room is a little cooler than it was when I first set everything up, largely because the storage heater has been turned down as it was sweltering in there yesterday. The viv is sited close to the window, which probably isn't ideal, however it's the cool end that is closest and to be honest I was expecting to have issues with the cool end not being warm enough. Perhaps the ceramic is having to work sufficiently hard to heat the warm end that the net result is excess heat at the other end? There is one other place in the room that the viv could be sited, although that would make a lot of work, but of course it would be silly to use that as an excuse if it could be causing issues.
I know I'm probably fussing like an old woman, but the last thing I want is an unhappy or unwell new arrival. Was everyone else so paranoid when they got their first royal? Our corns have never had so much fuss, they've got a heat mat at one end and everything takes care of itself. Nice gradient, steady temps... Maybe I'm too much of a perfectionist, either that or I'm a danger to all things reptilian? :s |
| Royalbob |
Posted - 19/12/2010 : 17:13:43
don't worry about the stat light. PP blink really quick and with a 100W bulb it will be fine. maybe the rooms just cold and the bulb has to work harder. But the stats not gonna burn out.
sounds like you just needed the cold/warm air circulating properly. My sat is set at 92F just go by your thermostat. |
| speedy231278 |
Posted - 19/12/2010 : 15:22:21
It's not right up against the wall, no. About six inches from it. I realise that placing it right against the wall would be bad for the temps, never mind the wall itself. I once had a fish tank that turned my parent's wallpaper mouldy because of that.
Anyway, I taped over the low vent and it does seem to have had an effect. The cool end is several degrees cooler than it was, and there's less of a difference between the top and the bottom. The stat is still full on, mind, but my thermometer agrees that the temp at the base is still not up to the 90 I have it set to. Will still see about doing some pics, but right now a late lunch is calling! |
| Royalbob |
Posted - 19/12/2010 : 14:04:44
It can't raise the temp above what it's set though. set it according to the thermastat temp probe. Do you have ventilation behind the viv it's not right up against the wall. |
| speedy231278 |
Posted - 19/12/2010 : 13:33:54
I'll try, but it's in a bot of an awkward place to take shots from! Centre of the ceramic is six inches from the end of the viv, seven from the back. I'll turn the stat up, but bear in mind it's been on all morning and hasn't really raised the temp at the warm end very much anyway! Will block the bottom vent at the warm end and see what happens. |
| Royalbob |
Posted - 19/12/2010 : 13:13:41
personally i would raise the stat to 90-92 so the hot spot is reading this temp as well. Also close the vent at the bottom on the hot side. Can you get some pics up?
|
| speedy231278 |
Posted - 19/12/2010 : 13:02:27
Yes - at the ambient end it's warmer at the top than the bottom. The VX36 has four vents, two at the top, two at the bottom. They're about an inch deep and I guess around 5 long. At the cool end it's 82 near the substrate but closer to top of the viv it's still around 88, and the stat is currently back to being full on. At the hot end, it's currently 84-85 near the substrate and 90-91 near the top. The stat agrees with the figure of 84 for the supposed hot spot. It's still set for 86 at present. Is the vent arrangement likely to be causing these readings? Right now, it seems I've got a vertical temperature gradient rather than a horizontal one! |
| Royalbob |
Posted - 19/12/2010 : 12:23:29
bit confused. are you saying its 88 near the top on cool side and 90 near the top on warm side???
Can't say i've ever measured the temps at differant heights. Just make sure the temp at floor of viv near the hot hide is at 90F. The pulse stats are amazing and they will keep it within a degree of this. Try not to keep messing with the stat otherwise your readings will be all over the place. 82 at the cool end is fine also. royals spend most of there time near or on the floor anyhow.
Not sure of the ventilation on the VX36 vivs but ideally you want a vent low down on the cool side and high up on the warm side. this creates proper air circulation and more even temps and humidity. If the vents are just at the top it's not the end of the world but you want the cool air to be drawn up towards the warm air. |
| speedy231278 |
Posted - 19/12/2010 : 11:05:55
Temp is down a little this morning, stat has been full on for most of the time rather than pulsing, but it's now settled back down. It was pretty chilly last night though. I'm still nervous about the difference in readings I can get at the cool end. It's about 82 near the bottom, but more like 86 or even 88 near the top, and surely that's too high? OK, the viv is 21" high so there's going to be a gradient from top to bottom, but that seems a bit much to me. Warm end currently varies from 84 to 90 depending on how high or low you measure the temp. At this rate I'm going to go neurotic!! |
| Royalbob |
Posted - 19/12/2010 : 00:34:59
Everything sounds perfect. yep place probe beside hot hide. Could even come down on temp a degree or two. Once bark dries out humidity will be spot on but 50-60% is fine. |
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