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Mogsy
Snake Mite
United Kingdom
16 Posts |
 Posted - 14/06/2009 : 16:28:24
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Please can I get some advice on respiratory infections?
My Royal, Max was making alot of noise on breathing and open mouth breathing.
Took him to the Vet who confirmed my suspicions and kept him in for last week, she put him on Antibiotics :IV 0.20 Fortum 500mg and oral 0.35mls Metacam + 0.98mls Baytril 2.5%.
Also she game me Bisolvon Powder 5gms to give him, she took a swab for culture that came back negative.
All the time the vet seemed very negative telling me that this would be a long process to get Max back to health and most respiratory infection kill Royals.
Could you please give me any advice or tips on how to help my Royal and if the treatment the vet has given sounds right, also is what she said true about most of cases ending badly?
Max is my first snake and any advice from your experience would be much appreciated.
Please help
Mogsy
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TIBERIUS
04/07/09 |
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dazb
Royal Python Moderator
United Kingdom
2847 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2009 : 16:32:28
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some one will be along soon to help you with the details as i have never dealt with a RI and afew people have on here.
I will say that i dont think its as serious as your vet says with most end up dying... so dont panic... |
 
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Blackecho
Royal Python Admin
United Kingdom
11327 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2009 : 16:33:49
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Sorry, but your vet is very mis-informed about RI's by the sound of it, it is very rare for a treated case to result in death.
Also, its quite unusual for them to be kept in for a week (I'm sure they charged for it though), usually you'll just get some medicine (Baytril is common) and administer it yourself.
Gingerpony on here is very good with this subject, I'll give her a nudge later (she's usually only on in the evenings) to come and offer better advice.
Now that its being treated though, you need to work out why it happened, to stop it happening again. Could you tell us about your setup, temps, thermometer, thermostats, humidity etc.
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Mogsy
Snake Mite
United Kingdom
16 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2009 : 16:45:05
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Thanks for that its reasuring.
I have a glass viv with a heat matt under the hot end and i also have a spot lamp to increase temp when needed. I have thermometers and a Hygrometer which i have reading of 26-32C in Hot end and 22-28C in the cool end, the Humidity is between 50-70%, i keep the water bowl in the cool end and change the water every day. He has hides in both ends and 2 large branches for climbing also one of those plants you buy for him to play in and hide in, all items were bought from proper reptile dealerships. I don't have thermostats but my temps are very consistant.
The vet did charge me for the week in though about £100 with medications, tests etc.
Thanks for getting back to me so fast. |
TIBERIUS
04/07/09 |
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Blackecho
Royal Python Admin
United Kingdom
11327 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2009 : 16:50:19
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Without being funny, your temps don't seem very consistent, 26-32C, also, when you're not there looking at the thermometer how can you tell? - i.e. in the middle of the night when it gets cold. Have you got digital or dial thermometers and hygrometers?
Glass tanks are very good at giving high humidity, something Royals don't like, 50-60% is plenty. |
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Mogsy
Snake Mite
United Kingdom
16 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2009 : 16:58:15
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Sorry i meant 32C during the day and down to 26C during the night. I have a digital Lucky Reptile gaget which measures both temps and humidity, it tells me what the high and low temps are for a time range so i check these at night before i go to bed and in the morning to check its not getting to cold at night.
Cheers for the advice i'll dial back the humidity. |
TIBERIUS
04/07/09 |
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Blackecho
Royal Python Admin
United Kingdom
11327 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2009 : 17:03:40
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Ok, I would cut out the night-time drop personally, at least until you're satisfied its back to full health. None of mine have a night-time drop.
I would thoroughly recommend a thermostat if possible as you can't guarantee that the mat won't overheat at some point (they can go wrong) and you'll only realise in the morning when you smell cooked snake. Also, on a hot day there is the constant heat from the mat and also the extra heat from outside. |
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wolfspirit
Old Royal - I Post too much!
United Kingdom
5741 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2009 : 17:04:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Mogsy
Sorry i meant 32C during the day and down to 26C during the night. I have a digital Lucky Reptile gaget which measures both temps and humidity, it tells me what the high and low temps are for a time range so i check these at night before i go to bed and in the morning to check its not getting to cold at night.
Cheers for the advice i'll dial back the humidity.
you dont need to reduce temps that much at night if at all..
i never reduce my temps and leave them as they are...
My royal had an RI and my first vet told me he had a disease that would kill him and was also constipated, fortunately i found this forum and got a lot of help here, then found a vet that knew what they were talking about ( a qualified exotics vet) i had to travel to find him, but it was well worth it and my snake was not dead in the thirty days the original vet to me would happen...in fact he is going great guns now...
have a read of this post
http://www.theroyalpython.co.uk/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1239
did you vet say why they prescribed Metacam? and what is the powder for?
Have you got any F10?
I am sure GP will add to this when she comes along to..
is your royal home now?
how is he doing? |
"No one can go back and make a brand new start. Anyone can start from
now and make a brand new ending."
-- Source Unknown
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Mogsy
Snake Mite
United Kingdom
16 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2009 : 17:19:29
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Thanks had a good read of that, it sound like you had a nightmare.
Max is back at home now i picked him up on Thursday, and have been giving him the Baytril and Metacam orally every day and giving him Fortum IM injection every 3 days.
I have some F10 and i am nebulising him twice a day for 20 mins but he isn't produsing very much mucus or bubbleling, just alot of open mouth breathing and noise on breathing.
He also will not eat, the vet said if he did it would be good, what do you think?
She never said what the Metacam was for i think she is just covering all the bases.
The powder is called Bisolvon and is a Mucolytic (dissolves Mucus) it just says to aid in the treatment of RI's.
I have seen very little increase or decrease in signs or symptoms since we first noticed he was bad 3 weeks ago to now. |
TIBERIUS
04/07/09 |
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wolfspirit
Old Royal - I Post too much!
United Kingdom
5741 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2009 : 17:28:38
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BE, can you remember what the dose was for F10?
my exotics vet recommended 1 drop per nostril of F10
i personally would not use Metacam, but only because it can damage liver and kidneys, i am not sure why this is being used..
i was not given any powder either and my royal was quite poorly by the time i eventually got him treated properly...
i was only using Baytril and F10
have you got a moss box in his viv?
if not then you can make one, keep it damp and keep it toward the warm end..my royal spent 99% of his time in there through his RI.
also has he got branches on which he can climb
not sure if after three weeks a temperature rise would help now..
he wont want to eat whilst he is not feeling well either..
where in the country are you? and is your vet an exotic vet?
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"No one can go back and make a brand new start. Anyone can start from
now and make a brand new ending."
-- Source Unknown
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wolfspirit
Old Royal - I Post too much!
United Kingdom
5741 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2009 : 17:33:03
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just found the doseage
here you go you can make this up
1ml diluted in 125ml water
find something to store it in and
i used 1 drop per nostril once a day...until the infection had cleared
the F10 kills bacteria in the lungs... |
"No one can go back and make a brand new start. Anyone can start from
now and make a brand new ending."
-- Source Unknown
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Mogsy
Snake Mite
United Kingdom
16 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2009 : 17:44:47
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| My F10 is already diluted 1:250 unfortunatly, i nebulise into the viv creating like a neb chamber, this is what i was advised by the vet. Max has branches for him to climb but dosen't want to at the moment he spends 85% of his time in his cool hide. How do i make a moss box, can i just get a small box and fill it with moist tissue paper or does it have to be actual moss? |
TIBERIUS
04/07/09 |
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Gingerpony
Royal Python Moderator
United Kingdom
2663 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2009 : 18:27:57
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quote:
Originally posted by Blackecho
Gingerpony on here is very good with this subject, I'll give her a nudge later (she's usually only on in the evenings)
if only!  LMAO |
Dumerils boas, BCO hybrids, Sinder Hypo boas, cornsnakes, ratsnakes, Day Geckos
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wolfspirit
Old Royal - I Post too much!
United Kingdom
5741 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2009 : 18:28:49
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quote:
Originally posted by Mogsy
My F10 is already diluted 1:250 unfortunatly, i nebulise into the viv creating like a neb chamber, this is what i was advised by the vet. Max has branches for him to climb but dosen't want to at the moment he spends 85% of his time in his cool hide. How do i make a moss box, can i just get a small box and fill it with moist tissue paper or does it have to be actual moss?
you can use paper, but it dries out quicker than moss..
a moss box is easy,
go here for the link
http://www.theroyalpython.co.uk/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1399
link on how to prepare moss here
http://www.theroyalpython.co.uk/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=710
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"No one can go back and make a brand new start. Anyone can start from
now and make a brand new ending."
-- Source Unknown
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Gingerpony
Royal Python Moderator
United Kingdom
2663 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2009 : 18:40:04
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Anne/wolfspirits tutorial on RIs covers just about everything
i'm quite shocked about what your vet has said though...........the only thing i can think of for such a poor prognosis is the severity of the case, which could mean a stay hospitalized........
out of interest, did you have to sign a disclaimer for the metacam as i believe it's only liscenced in cats and dogs? not sure about the Bisolvon sachets either, we don't us them much.
the C&S done on the tracheal wash/swab should show which antibiotics to use....... i'm unsure of what a 'negative' result would mean though.........? no sensitivity/resistance?
and anne/WS knows everything there is to know about F10 |
Dumerils boas, BCO hybrids, Sinder Hypo boas, cornsnakes, ratsnakes, Day Geckos
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wolfspirit
Old Royal - I Post too much!
United Kingdom
5741 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2009 : 18:48:23
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I knew Ali would come through for you..lol...thanks Ali..
i think finding an exotic vet would be a good start...
where in the country are you?
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"No one can go back and make a brand new start. Anyone can start from
now and make a brand new ending."
-- Source Unknown
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Mogsy
Snake Mite
United Kingdom
16 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2009 : 21:02:35
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Thanks alot for all your advice and help, i'll keep you informed on Max's progress.
I'm in Glasgow but the vet i went to claims to be an exotic Vet, i'll try to find someone better though.
I didn't have to sign a disclamer for the Metacam but will ask about it when i see her again.
I'm going to get on the moss box first thing tomorrom.
Thanks again for all your help guys. |
TIBERIUS
04/07/09 |
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Gingerpony
Royal Python Moderator
United Kingdom
2663 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2009 : 21:31:39
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re the Metacam (and possibly Bisolvon) because it's licensed for cats and dogs only, if you want to use it for a different species it can be prescribed under CASCADE - where if a drug has been used successfully in another species that it's not liscenced for it can still be used. at the vets i work for there's paperwork to be filled in in these circumstances.
unusual for a painkiller to be prescribed in the case of an RI so keep me informed as i'm very interested in this one |
Dumerils boas, BCO hybrids, Sinder Hypo boas, cornsnakes, ratsnakes, Day Geckos
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Gingerpony
Royal Python Moderator
United Kingdom
2663 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2009 : 21:34:37
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| and although there's a couple of 'exotic' vets local to me, i do know one practice specialises in torts and the other in zoo animals, so exotic doesn't necessarily mean snakes but they'll usually have a better idea than your average 'smallies' vet |
Dumerils boas, BCO hybrids, Sinder Hypo boas, cornsnakes, ratsnakes, Day Geckos
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wolfspirit
Old Royal - I Post too much!
United Kingdom
5741 Posts |
Posted - 14/06/2009 : 22:15:33
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I have just been given these two vets for you, apparently they are the best, dont have numbers but here you go
Lawrie's in Falkirk
and
Lawries in cumbernauld. michael orsey is the vet to see there..
both top notch, not sure how far they are from you.. |
"No one can go back and make a brand new start. Anyone can start from
now and make a brand new ending."
-- Source Unknown
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Edited by - wolfspirit on 14/06/2009 22:17:02 |
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Mogsy
Snake Mite
United Kingdom
16 Posts |
Posted - 15/06/2009 : 09:26:58
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Lawries in cumbernauld is the one i went to but i spoke to a vet called Vicky, will try and get to see michael orsey.
Max tryed to eat last night and reguratated it very quickly and he is now noisier that ever.
Thanks for all your help, will keep you updated. |
TIBERIUS
04/07/09 |
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Topic |
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Help got Respiratory Infection
