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millar69er
Snake Mite
United Kingdom
1 Posts |
 Posted - 03/10/2010 : 17:16:08
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hi there to all,
i have read up on several sites that a royal python kept in wooden viv should not have a heatmat for heating and have also seen that they can have a heatmat, can anyone confirm please what is the correct method, i am going to be using a 3ft long by 2 ft wide wooden viv for our 3 year old female who is around 3 1/2 ft to 4 ft in length ,i have also been told that they need ground heat to digest food so a mat is perfect,my head is spinning with all the different views, if i used a ceramic bulb (in a guard)how will this heat the aspen under the hide to correct temp??, can someone please show me pics and details on correct wooden viv set ups,i know that heatmats are used on rubs for adults so why not in vivs, sorry for being a pain but you have to learn some how and if you dont ask you dont get, |
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Blackecho
Royal Python Admin
United Kingdom
11327 Posts |
Posted - 03/10/2010 : 18:18:04
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In a viv a bulb (IR or Ceramic) is better.
Heatmats are fine under RUBs, but not inside vivs. Royals are heavy bodied as adults and you could get thermal blocking and burns. |
 
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nok1888
Yearling
United Kingdom
314 Posts |
Posted - 04/10/2010 : 14:13:40
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| Ive got a heat mat in mine covered with 3 layers of kitchen roll and aspen so theres no direct contact with the mat. Ive checked temps every day and always 29.4C unless she's in it then its 30C, Ive got a laser temp gun too and use that to check surface temp inside whe shes not in it to see if digital thermometer is accurate and its always bang on the same. Didnt know anything about thermal blocking though |
0.1.0 Royal Normal - Orlina Bodhi Lobsang
1.0.0 Royal Normal - Sedrick Rinzen Sonam
2.0.0 Cats 18 y/o - Monty, kitten - Dodger
2.0.0 Border Collie's 7 y/o - Jinky, 2 y/o - Chance
0.0.5 Goldfish - Haggis, Pookie, Oddball, Spongebob and Slimey (kids eh lol)
Strange creature, unknown species, wife likes to call it "teenage daughter"
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nok1888
Yearling
United Kingdom
314 Posts |
Posted - 04/10/2010 : 17:31:37
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| Just read up about thermo blocking, Ive put the thermometer probe in the middle of her hide in the middle of the aspen so I'll watch if temps differ when she's in it |
0.1.0 Royal Normal - Orlina Bodhi Lobsang
1.0.0 Royal Normal - Sedrick Rinzen Sonam
2.0.0 Cats 18 y/o - Monty, kitten - Dodger
2.0.0 Border Collie's 7 y/o - Jinky, 2 y/o - Chance
0.0.5 Goldfish - Haggis, Pookie, Oddball, Spongebob and Slimey (kids eh lol)
Strange creature, unknown species, wife likes to call it "teenage daughter"
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jimb87
Snake Mite
12 Posts |
Posted - 04/10/2010 : 17:52:11
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| iv always kept my royals in a viv with only a heat mat and iv never had problems. As long as you have a mat stat your be fine. The snake would not burn itself even if it was laying directly on a heat mat at a temp of 31 c |
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Blackecho
Royal Python Admin
United Kingdom
11327 Posts |
Posted - 04/10/2010 : 18:47:38
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quote:
Originally posted by jimb87
iv always kept my royals in a viv with only a heat mat and iv never had problems. As long as you have a mat stat your be fine. The snake would not burn itself even if it was laying directly on a heat mat at a temp of 31 c
Do you even know what thermal blocking is? |
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jimb87
Snake Mite
12 Posts |
Posted - 04/10/2010 : 19:30:04
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Thermal blocking occurs when the heat produced by the
system warms the floor surface but is then trapped and
has no way of escaping from the surface of the floor.
This can cause the system to overheat in the thermally
blocked area and, in extreme cases, affect the integrity
of the floor covering and heating system. |
Edited by - jimb87 on 04/10/2010 19:36:31 |
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jimb87
Snake Mite
12 Posts |
Posted - 04/10/2010 : 19:44:43
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| all i was saying was, i have kept royals for 3 years in vivs with only heatmats all linked to matstats and all with seperate digital thermometers, for more acurate temp reading. My snakes have never burned, and are all very healthy. |
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Blackecho
Royal Python Admin
United Kingdom
11327 Posts |
Posted - 04/10/2010 : 20:16:13
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quote:
Originally posted by jimb87
As long as you have a mat stat your be fine. The snake would not burn itself even if it was laying directly on a heat mat at a temp of 31 c
It was that bit that I was referring to. This is not true as thermal blocking can occur even on a statted mat and even if the mat is set at 31C, can get a lot hotter with thermal blocking.
Yes, you and others may get away with it, but that does not mean it cannot happen. I am just giving facts so that people can make informed decisions about whether they want to take risks with their pets.
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jimb87
Snake Mite
12 Posts |
Posted - 04/10/2010 : 20:26:14
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| yes snakes do get burned on heatmats with matstats, but its very very rare. Do you think this has more of a chance of the mat stat being faulty? If one snake does'nt burn on a heatmat at 31c then none of them should, in theroy. My big girl weighs in just under 2 kilo and can quite happily sit directly on the heat mat for hours on end without any burning. Im also aware that without a matstat the temp can rise to 45c very quickly which would most defo cause burns |
Edited by - jimb87 on 04/10/2010 20:35:27 |
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jimb87
Snake Mite
12 Posts |
Posted - 04/10/2010 : 20:40:10
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| I guess there is a way to test that out, You could get a heat mat and 2 thermometers place 1 probe losely on the heat mat and the other probe weigh down with a heavy book or somthing similar. And see the difference in the readings. |
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Blackecho
Royal Python Admin
United Kingdom
11327 Posts |
Posted - 04/10/2010 : 21:35:41
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I'm not one for linking to other forums, however there is a very important thread people should read regarding this subject. It includes information from the manufacturer of Habistat heat mats regarding their use. It has been written by a highly respected member of the Herpetelogical society. Maybe if you wont listen to me, you'll listen to them. If one snake is saved pain, then its worthwhile:
http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/forums/snakes/242314-heat-mats-what-happen-when.html
Be aware, there are graphic images. |
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reptiledanny
Old Royal - I Post too much!
United Kingdom
2106 Posts |
Posted - 05/10/2010 : 07:16:26
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wow, that has bought a tear to my, and i promise to myself now that will never use a heat mat on anything apart from a corn (are they ok to be used with adult corn snakes??) that is really terrible and feel so angry at the original owners
please let this be a lesson to all you royal owners that think about a heat mat, bulbs are the way |
1.2 royal pythons 0.1 hog island boa 1.0 corn snake
sig made by stapey |
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Blackecho
Royal Python Admin
United Kingdom
11327 Posts |
Posted - 05/10/2010 : 08:32:08
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| Corns are fine Danny, not enough body to be a problem as far as I'm aware. |
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Kazerella
Royal Python Admin
United Kingdom
1196 Posts |
Posted - 05/10/2010 : 10:21:36
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....and kings, hoggies, garters
Only keepers with big bodied snakes need to know the risks. |
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Snecklifter
Yearling
United Kingdom
144 Posts |
Posted - 05/10/2010 : 13:26:53
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| I'd say that the way in which the owners kept the snake and the (incorrect) way in which the heat mat appeared to have been used were the cause of the injuries to the snake (no mention was made of a thermostat for example), not the use of a heat mat per ce. Personally, I use a mat and a lamp, the mat is on a thermostat set at 29 degrees and this is covered by kitchen towel and bark substrate, therefore, any heat generated by the mat dissipates through the relatively looose layers above it. |
0.0.1 Royal 'Trowzer' |
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n/a
deleted
7384 Posts |
Posted - 05/10/2010 : 16:01:39
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Like many people, I have lino over the heat mats (all statted of course) but my Shahi, the royal, has an infra-red light, guarded, which at the moment is only used if I need to light his viv to see what I'm doing, or what he's doing. I plan to use the infra-red as sole source of heating (dimmer stat in post) but keep the existing heat mat set-up as backup for emergencies.
This winter I was planning to use the infra-red heat in the day and let his his heatmat kick in at night (he is only six months old, if that.)
Can you brains out there tell me if this is a good arrangement? Thanks in advance. |
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n/a
deleted
7384 Posts |
Posted - 05/10/2010 : 16:06:19
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| Sorry - see above - I should have said - is this a feasible arrangement for a snake of this age? |
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Blackecho
Royal Python Admin
United Kingdom
11327 Posts |
Posted - 05/10/2010 : 16:23:54
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| What is the heatmat for? |
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Blackecho
Royal Python Admin
United Kingdom
11327 Posts |
Posted - 05/10/2010 : 16:31:04
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quote:
Originally posted by Roly
I'd say that the way in which the owners kept the snake and the (incorrect) way in which the heat mat appeared to have been used were the cause of the injuries to the snake (no mention was made of a thermostat for example), not the use of a heat mat per ce.
quote:
NEVER HAVE A HEAT MAT ON THE INSIDE FLOOR OF A VIV THAT HOUSES ONE OR MORE HEAVY BODIED SNAKES, AS EVEN IF STATED, THERMAL BLOCKING CAN STILL OCCUR, CAUSING THE MAT TO OVERHEAT AND CAUSE BURN INJURIES TO THE SNAKE ON IT'S UNDERNEATH AS HAPPENED HERE, OR THE MAT COULD CATCH FIRE.
This situation was discussed with Peter F who makes Habistat heat mats.
Peter kindly decided to adjust the heat mat instructions in order to ensure people understood that heat mats are not recommended for heavy bodied snakes to lay on due to thermal blocking causing horrible injuries such as these. It is also a fact that large snakes release a lot of body fluids which in turn could seep into the terminal block that houses the electric wire, and cause that to short out and that could cause a fire.
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Snecklifter
Yearling
United Kingdom
144 Posts |
Posted - 05/10/2010 : 16:41:13
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| I think there's a certain amount of hysteria and dare I say it scare mongering associated with that post and the responses it has provoked. |
0.0.1 Royal 'Trowzer' |
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heatmat in viv
Topic Locked
