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JayJ
Snake Mite
United Kingdom
21 Posts |
 Posted - 27/08/2011 : 17:01:42
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Hi guys, I'm Jason and new to this forum although I do have 3 yrs forum experience from my other hobby RC.
I am the very proud owner of two Royal Pythons; Khal (male, I think) and Khaleesi (female, I think). I have only had them for around a month and I believe them to be approx 12 months old, this obviously only going by what I have been told though.
Khal is approx 3 ft and Khaleesi is approx 3 1/2 ft, these are only an estimate judging from the 4 ft Vivarium they are in.
Yes I know this may not be popular but my Royals do cohabit, I know the pros and cons and I have to agree with the cons but they were cohabiting when I got them. Obviously my worries are disease, mites, behaviour, aggression, tracking passings etc.
I am seriously considering separating them but my concern is whether they are used to living together, I know some don't think Snakes have feelings etc and I'm honestly not sure where I stand on this but I guess trying is my only option.
Below are a few videos I have taken of my Viv and male Royal Khal, I am making some changes to the Viv atm as they currently have a Heat Matt but I have a 100W Ceramic Heater to go in there and a full length Florescent tube rather than the light currently in there. I haven't made the changes as yet although I have the parts because Khaleesi is about to shed.
Hope you like the videos, any input, comments, suggestions all greatly recieved. Please excuse my noisy girls! lol
Thanks for looking!!
http://youtu.be/p8KLKI5uAuk
http://youtu.be/qrjKWRRW2rg
http://youtu.be/ZGAqSdUvNb0 |
 
1.1.0 Royal Python (Normal)
1.0.0 Staffordshire Bull Terrier
2.1.0 Domestic Short Haired Cat
0.0.1 Horsefeild Tortoise |
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boomslang
Old Royal - I Post too much!
United Kingdom
2025 Posts |
Posted - 27/08/2011 : 19:52:17
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quote:
Yes I know this may not be popular but my Royals do cohabit, I know the pros and cons and I have to agree with the cons but they were cohabiting when I got them. Obviously my worries are disease, mites, behaviour, aggression, tracking passings etc.
I've seen all kinds of animals in shops sold together,And labelled as fine to cohabit etc etc.
When in fact there not,And as you state,you no the risks.Alot of people ask,no the risks,but do it anyway.
I wouldnt cohabit As for most,the cons far outweigh the pros,But there your snakes :P
quote:
Below are a few videos I have taken of my Viv and male Royal Khal, I am making some changes to the Viv atm as they currently have a Heat Matt but I have a 100W Ceramic Heater to go in there and a full length Florescent tube rather than the light currently in there. I haven't made the changes as yet although I have the parts because Khaleesi is about to shed.
The viv looks great,id change the mat with the ceramic,As you are going to do.
Then just take the mat out,Light bulb etc is your choice.
When you replace the mat.up the temps on the hot side to around 32/32,and removed that black tape fixing the prob on..sticky tape and snakes don't mix.
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1.0.0 pinstripe Royal Python
1.0.0 Bumblebee Royal Python
1.0.0 Normal corn
1.0.0 Extreme red Hognose
0.1.0 Extreme red tiger Hognose
1.1.0 yemen chameleons
1.0.0 Piebald yemen
1.0.0 Tamatave panther
1.0.0 Quadricornis
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boomslang
Old Royal - I Post too much!
United Kingdom
2025 Posts |
Posted - 27/08/2011 : 19:56:57
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quote:
100W Ceramic Heater to go in there and a full length Florescent tube rather than the light currently in there. I haven't made the changes as yet although I have the parts because Khaleesi is about to shed.
Why don't you just put the ceramic on the other side?And leave that light where it is.
As its guarded where it is.They might pull a tube down etc. |
1.0.0 pinstripe Royal Python
1.0.0 Bumblebee Royal Python
1.0.0 Normal corn
1.0.0 Extreme red Hognose
0.1.0 Extreme red tiger Hognose
1.1.0 yemen chameleons
1.0.0 Piebald yemen
1.0.0 Tamatave panther
1.0.0 Quadricornis
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JayJ
Snake Mite
United Kingdom
21 Posts |
Posted - 28/08/2011 : 11:17:35
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quote:
Originally posted by boomslang
I've seen all kinds of animals in shops sold together,And labelled as fine to cohabit etc etc.
When in fact there not,And as you state,you no the risks.Alot of people ask,no the risks,but do it anyway.
I wouldnt cohabit As for most,the cons far outweigh the pros,But there your snakes :P
I totally agree but for now they must cohabit whilst I'm on the look out for a reasonably priced Viv, I think I have found one but I need some funds. This will only be temporary.
quote:
Originally posted by boomslang
The viv looks great,id change the mat with the ceramic,As you are going to do.
Then just take the mat out,Light bulb etc is your choice.
When you replace the mat.up the temps on the hot side to around 32/32,and removed that black tape fixing the prob on..sticky tape and snakes don't mix.
I seem to be having temp problems atm, if my hot side gets to 30/32 my cool side is only a degree or two behind it so with the light on during the day the hot end reaches 32 the cool end is 28/29. Would more ventilation help??
As for the tape I really didn't want to use it but I have no other way to adhere the probes?? They are Exo Terra and came with suction cups for a Glass Vivarium/Terrarium but these won't stick to a wood Vivarium??
Also where is best for the HabiStat probe?? I read that if using a Heat Matt the probe should be next to the matt but where would be best when I install the Ceramic Heater??
EDIT- Sorry if this is a silly question but what are my Royals?? Are they just normal/common Royals or do the have a name?? Pic of Khal in my sig or Video above. Also to add they both seem to have "Marbling" on their underside?
Apologies if my ignorance offends!! |
1.1.0 Royal Python (Normal)
1.0.0 Staffordshire Bull Terrier
2.1.0 Domestic Short Haired Cat
0.0.1 Horsefeild Tortoise |
Edited by - JayJ on 28/08/2011 11:23:07 |
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n/a
deleted
7384 Posts |
Posted - 28/08/2011 : 12:57:45
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I use these ...
Screw eyes from B&Q, fiver for 25.
No, no 'offends' about it - we're all learning all the time. I put my stat probes about a foot away from the warm side wall; I screw one of these little gismos into the front panel underneath the viv window, secure probe with a cable tie, snip off long end of tie, and probe SHOULD stay in place, snake permitting.
Yes, I got advised to use sticky tape when I first started and later learned it's bad news ...I confess I still have strips as 'bumpers' on the opening sides of one viv window, where an amorous corn snake would have otherwise rubbed her nose raw on the glass. Trouble is, removing the stuff would leave sticky patches only removable with WD40, rendering the viv uninhabitable. When removing in-viv, you could try washing up liquid and hot water and a panscrub, rinsing well; it's easier to get the tackiness off the wood. But I hate the stuff - you live and you learn eh?
Khal and Khaleesi are beautiful; they look like normals to me; the underside markings sound normal too, but there is such a huge variance even in normals (that's how the morphs started to be bred) that no normal is ever 'normal'!
All the best.
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Edited by - n/a on 28/08/2011 13:01:29 |
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JayJ
Snake Mite
United Kingdom
21 Posts |
Posted - 28/08/2011 : 13:55:46
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| Thanks for understanding and the advice, really appreciated!! |
1.1.0 Royal Python (Normal)
1.0.0 Staffordshire Bull Terrier
2.1.0 Domestic Short Haired Cat
0.0.1 Horsefeild Tortoise |
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boomslang
Old Royal - I Post too much!
United Kingdom
2025 Posts |
Posted - 28/08/2011 : 21:17:27
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quote:
seem to be having temp problems atm, if my hot side gets to 30/32 my cool side is only a degree or two behind it so with the light on during the day the hot end reaches 32 the cool end is 28/29. Would more ventilation help??
As for the tape I really didn't want to use it but I have no other way to adhere the probes?? They are Exo Terra and came with suction cups for a Glass Vivarium/Terrarium but these won't stick to a wood Vivarium??
Also where is best for the HabiStat probe?? I read that if using a Heat Matt the probe should be next to the matt but where would be best when I install the Ceramic Heater??
EDIT- Sorry if this is a silly question but what are my Royals?? Are they just normal/common Royals or do the have a name?? Pic of Khal in my sig or Video above. Also to add they both seem to have "Marbling" on their underside?
Apologies if my ignorance offends!!
Seeing as its a heat mat,Just get the temp right on the mat.And you sure it heats the whole thing up just from a mat?That seems very unlikely.
The light bulb,is a normal/2.0 compact or something?and not a basking spot?
Anyway i've had problems in the past with ceramic heaters,One side getting 32 the other 31 :P or like that.Was due to ventilation and the room was getting very hot.
put the HabiStat probe under the bulb,You might need to move it around bit,to find the best spot.
As for the temp probes,I normally put one under the bulb on the hot side,or in the hot hide.Then one in the cold side hide..
Depending on the snake :) Just don't screw the probe halfway up the viv. |
1.0.0 pinstripe Royal Python
1.0.0 Bumblebee Royal Python
1.0.0 Normal corn
1.0.0 Extreme red Hognose
0.1.0 Extreme red tiger Hognose
1.1.0 yemen chameleons
1.0.0 Piebald yemen
1.0.0 Tamatave panther
1.0.0 Quadricornis
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Edited by - boomslang on 28/08/2011 21:31:01 |
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Royalbob
Royal Python Moderator
United Kingdom
1115 Posts |
Posted - 29/08/2011 : 22:19:52
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Just from what i've seen so pls correct if i'm wrong. Also money allowing do these things when you can.
1. ditch the heat mat in the viv as well as being dangerous there is no need to run it with a bulb. You could then use the heat mat attached to a thermostat on the out side of a rub for the other royal.
2. swop the light bulb (way too bright for a nocturnal animal) for an I.R or ceramic. Put the I.R or ceramic pointing downwards on one side with a guard attached to a dimming stat or PP if you use ceramic.
This is left to run 24/7. At present your bulb is pointing out to the length of the viv therefore heating in that direction also which along with poor ventilation will be causing your temp problems.
Set the hot spot to 32/34c, i find the cool side looks after its self once there is adequate ventilation. Excuse if i'm wrong but i couldn't see any unblocked vents on your video.
Ideally one at top of hot side and one at bottom of cool side, this will circulate the air the best.
set temps and stat according to thermometer.
Low branches or logs will be ok, not high ones royals are clumsy. No extra light is needed, you can use led or low watt energy savers if you wish.
Hope that helps.
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1.0 Enchi butter
1.0 Enchi X Pastel
1.0 Fire het clown
1.0 Bumblebee
1.0 pinstripe
0.1 Enchi Fire
0.1 Pastel calico
0.1 Yellow belly Pinstripe
0.1 Lemon pastel poss het clown
0.1 Het clown
0.1 Yellow belly
0.1 Green Mojave
0.1 HC Albino
0.2 Normals
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JayJ
Snake Mite
United Kingdom
21 Posts |
Posted - 31/08/2011 : 01:43:34
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Thanks for the help guys, really grateful!!
Woke this morning to find Khaleesi had shed so made some real changes to the Viv today, removed all the substrate and cleaned the Viv out with F10 Disinfectant spray.
The Heat Mat and Light are gone and in their place are a 100 Watt Ceramic Heater and Fluorescent Light, the Orchid Bark has gone also as I've used Aspen Substrate instead and added a small amount of Sphagnum Moss around the water bowl for humidity.
I have also added some vents but unfortunately put both ends at the top of the Viv?? If I'd read the above post then I would have put the cool end vents at the bottom.
I know this is a video thread but I have some pictures I took earlier.
I am a little concerned as to how low the Guard sits though??
They were very inquisitive and spent the next 30 minutes roaming around the Viv, exploring and investigating their new surroundings. I am unsure if the 100 watt Ceramic Heater is going to be enough to heat my 46" Viv?? I will be keeping an eye on the Thermometers and we'll see how things go.
Royalbob, thanks for the advice. I have been thinking about using a RUB but I have some questions, if you don't mind.
I have a 145 Litre RUB and heat matt, I just need another Thermostat but do I treat RUB like a Viv? Should I have a hot and cool end and what size heat matt should I use (I have two)??
Any links to threads about using RUBs would be appreciated. Thanks! |
1.1.0 Royal Python (Normal)
1.0.0 Staffordshire Bull Terrier
2.1.0 Domestic Short Haired Cat
0.0.1 Horsefeild Tortoise |
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n/a
deleted
7384 Posts |
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JayJ
Snake Mite
United Kingdom
21 Posts |
Posted - 31/08/2011 : 12:22:24
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Thanks, I am happy because they are happy. All I want is happy snakes, what's the point otherwise!!
Thanks for the links have read some but will read the rest later, hopefully the RUB will arrive soon.
Couple more Q's please?? The guard is quite hot, is this normal? I can hold my hand on for some time so not ridiculously hot but should it concern me?? Also with how low the guard is should I look for a shallower guard, as can be seen from the pics there's only 2-2 1/2" from the top of the hide? |
1.1.0 Royal Python (Normal)
1.0.0 Staffordshire Bull Terrier
2.1.0 Domestic Short Haired Cat
0.0.1 Horsefeild Tortoise |
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n/a
deleted
7384 Posts |
Posted - 31/08/2011 : 13:50:23
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Yes, the guard does get hot, but the sides are cooler - thank heaven adult royals are too clumsy to wrap themselves round a guard like a corn or boa might, but even then the heat ought not to be dangerous with a statted bulb. (Amendment - my Shahi used to climb on his guard as a baby, but fortunately he was fine.)
I've only ever had one hairy experience with a bulb guard and that was when I moved Saffy off her heat mat. Now, she knew about guards, as she'd had a low watt lightbulb that was switched on for illumination if needed, cleaning out etc, and guarded. But for some reason, when first with IR, in the early hours (she was feeling amorous at the time; she's the one who kept trying her viv windows) she did her damnedest to push her nose through the bottom of her guard ...thank god for insomnia ...I had to turn off all heat (luckily it was a warm night) and next day reinstate her mat until she calmed down. She's been fine since with bulb and guard.
For this reason, although the bottom of the guard is so obtrusive, I wouldn't worry - the further away the bulb is from the base of the guard the better. Plus, I don't think they do smaller sizes; I was amazed to see a larger size on sale at Blue Lizard, but usually all you see is that particular model.
I don't care for these guards myself; if I had the money/space/carpentry skills, I'd design and build vivs where the heat source was in an enclosed cage (opening from outside for ease of bulb changing) large enough to keep the viv's occupant from approaching anywhere near the bulb but at the same time maintaining the right ambient temp ...ah, utopia eh? |
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Edited by - n/a on 31/08/2011 13:55:21 |
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JayJ
Snake Mite
United Kingdom
21 Posts |
Posted - 31/08/2011 : 14:05:05
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| Thanks, you've put my mind at rest!! |
1.1.0 Royal Python (Normal)
1.0.0 Staffordshire Bull Terrier
2.1.0 Domestic Short Haired Cat
0.0.1 Horsefeild Tortoise |
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Royalbob
Royal Python Moderator
United Kingdom
1115 Posts |
Posted - 31/08/2011 : 15:31:52
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Think bats has covered it all but basically an easy way to go is the length of snake should roughly equal the length and depth of rub. generally 32l rub for an adult is fine unless it's a big female. i place the heat mat so it covers between 1/3 and 1/2 of the rub so just use which ever one;s a more suitable size. an economical way would be to place the rub on the cool side of the viv that way it will be heated by up to a nice ambient temp. Test temps for a day first and adjust before placing your snake in. i place the stat probe so it is sandwiched between the heat mat and the rub then use a thermometer on the inside under hot hide to read the temps. Again set the stat according to the thermometer not the dial on the stat.
Hope that helps. p.s the guard is fine just get your hot spot to 90F and your ambient should level out around 80F. let us know how it goes. |
1.0 Enchi butter
1.0 Enchi X Pastel
1.0 Fire het clown
1.0 Bumblebee
1.0 pinstripe
0.1 Enchi Fire
0.1 Pastel calico
0.1 Yellow belly Pinstripe
0.1 Lemon pastel poss het clown
0.1 Het clown
0.1 Yellow belly
0.1 Green Mojave
0.1 HC Albino
0.2 Normals
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Royalbob
Royal Python Moderator
United Kingdom
1115 Posts |
Posted - 31/08/2011 : 15:37:45
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| Also it might be a little easier on their eyes without the fluorescent tube as they are nocturnal so natural daylight is enough. |
1.0 Enchi butter
1.0 Enchi X Pastel
1.0 Fire het clown
1.0 Bumblebee
1.0 pinstripe
0.1 Enchi Fire
0.1 Pastel calico
0.1 Yellow belly Pinstripe
0.1 Lemon pastel poss het clown
0.1 Het clown
0.1 Yellow belly
0.1 Green Mojave
0.1 HC Albino
0.2 Normals
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JayJ
Snake Mite
United Kingdom
21 Posts |
Posted - 31/08/2011 : 16:41:24
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Okay, thanks mate but Khal is the smallest and around 3ft so would I need a bigger RUB?? Would an 84L be enough or should I go with the 145L??
Would it be okay to alternate them between the RUB and the Viv every month or so, obviously cleaning the Viv and then changing them over??
As for my Viv I'm having humidity problems using the Aspen substrate, didn't have any problems with the Orchid Bark but I sprayed the Viv this morning as the humidity was low and 5 hrs later the humidity is at 31%?? I have a small amount of Sphagnum Moss in there as can be seen from the pictures, even that seems to have dried out??
I'm only using the light for viewing purposes, it's off atm although the room they are in is quiet dark??
Tried feeding Khaleesi this morning and she took interest initially, tongue was going and she was fixed on the rat but didn't take it. She then lost interest? She hasn't eaten since I've had them, I was told she had eaten about two weeks before I got them so about five weeks in total and she has shed twice since I've had them?? |
1.1.0 Royal Python (Normal)
1.0.0 Staffordshire Bull Terrier
2.1.0 Domestic Short Haired Cat
0.0.1 Horsefeild Tortoise |
Edited by - JayJ on 31/08/2011 16:49:23 |
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boomslang
Old Royal - I Post too much!
United Kingdom
2025 Posts |
Posted - 31/08/2011 : 17:55:23
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quote:
Okay, thanks mate but Khal is the smallest and around 3ft so would I need a bigger RUB?? Would an 84L be enough or should I go with the 145L??
Would it be okay to alternate them between the RUB and the Viv every month or so, obviously cleaning the Viv and then changing them over??
So you putting them both in the same rub?as for moving them,moving to clean is fine.But changing them over for weeks,then moving them back and so on,might freak them out alittle.
quote:
As for my Viv I'm having humidity problems using the Aspen substrate, didn't have any problems with the Orchid Bark but I sprayed the Viv this morning as the humidity was low and 5 hrs later the humidity is at 31%?? I have a small amount of Sphagnum Moss in there as can be seen from the pictures, even that seems to have dried out??
it will be higher,as you have moss in there,and the aspen kinda soaks up the water better.
You don't need to spray it or mess around to much,the viv should hold the humidity without it,you can up it,or spray more when there in blue etc.
if its an exo terra humidity reader,there crap anyway,so the reading will be of to.Where do you have the probe? |
1.0.0 pinstripe Royal Python
1.0.0 Bumblebee Royal Python
1.0.0 Normal corn
1.0.0 Extreme red Hognose
0.1.0 Extreme red tiger Hognose
1.1.0 yemen chameleons
1.0.0 Piebald yemen
1.0.0 Tamatave panther
1.0.0 Quadricornis
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Edited by - boomslang on 31/08/2011 17:59:39 |
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JayJ
Snake Mite
United Kingdom
21 Posts |
Posted - 31/08/2011 : 19:12:06
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No using a RUB was a way to separate them, keeping one in the Viv and one in a RUB. I just thought rather than one being permanently in a RUB I could swap them around?
The moss is almost dry though?
From what I've read the humidity should be around 50%? With the Orchid Bark I had no problems keeping the Humidity around that level, I knew the Aspen would be dryer be not as dry as it appears to be?
Yes the Hydrometer is Exo Terra, the probe is in the middle of the Viv about 4-5" from the floor of the substrate. Can be clearly seen in the first pic in my above post.
Thanks!! |
1.1.0 Royal Python (Normal)
1.0.0 Staffordshire Bull Terrier
2.1.0 Domestic Short Haired Cat
0.0.1 Horsefeild Tortoise |
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n/a
deleted
7384 Posts |
Posted - 31/08/2011 : 21:02:26
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A royal python values permanency above anything ...whatever it's in, as long as space, temps etc are ok, that's HOME. It likes everything to be the same, for ever. Which ever royal you move into the rub, once it settles, won't complain.  |
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JayJ
Snake Mite
United Kingdom
21 Posts |
Posted - 31/08/2011 : 22:21:38
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Thanks Bats, will have to decide which I put in the RUB. Suppose it doesn't really matter? I have just ordered an 84L RUB off eBay, hopefully be here in a couple of days.
Any other input on my humidity issue?? I was under the impression the humidity needed to be 50-60% which it was with the Orchid Bark but not the Aspen, I've just sprayed the Sphagnum again and it's only 38%?? Confused?? |
1.1.0 Royal Python (Normal)
1.0.0 Staffordshire Bull Terrier
2.1.0 Domestic Short Haired Cat
0.0.1 Horsefeild Tortoise |
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n/a
deleted
7384 Posts |
Posted - 31/08/2011 : 22:46:18
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Ah. There is a lot of debate about this, plus hygrometers.
I'm a humidity coward. I don't use hygrometers. I've heard these gismos can be massively inaccurate, and being a worrybucket, I can do without them lol. I did try a moss hide but it went smelly. I don't spray at all. When a snake goes blue, as soon as it clears, I put the water dish in the hot end - extra evaporation = more humidity. Once the shed's over with, the water dish goes back in the cold end. The only concession I make is to have Shahi's water dish permanently in his warm end after a few messy sheds when he was a baby but I reckon he would probably be okay if I put it back in his cold side now, apart from the eye clearing pre-shed period ...I'm a lazy git, but other people may approach the situation more erm ... technically lol. |
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My Royal Pythons
